Flat Earth Conspiracy

Pointing out the absurdity of “flat Earth” theory…is it really necessary? I’ve noticed that there are more and more videos popping up on YouTube touting a number of related ideas, that the Earth is actually flat (or some other non-spherical shape), and that the fundamental nature of the cosmos is radically different than that presented by modern science, namely, that the Earth is a planet that orbits the Sun with the other planets and bodies of the solar system, and that the Sun is one of many stars in a galaxy which is but one of many. It seems preposterous that anyone at the dawn of the 21st century would believe the Earth is flat, or that anyone would promote such an idea as more than a joke, but apparently some do.

The spherical shape of the Earth has been well-known for over two thousand years. It was a well-understood concept in Greek science as early as the 5th century BC. Eratosthenes produced a fairly accurate estimate of the Earth’s circumference around 240 BC using simple geometry and some basic measurements. Besides simple measurements, there are many obvious observational phenomena that indicate the Earth must be round, such as the fact that different stars are visible to people in different lattitudes. This would not be the case if the Earth were flat. Flat-Earthers will make excuses and talk about “distortion”, “perspective”, or other absurd ideas, but they can’t explain such obvious things away in a scientifically consistent manner. Flat-Earthers will also claim that the Sun and Moon are relatively small bodies that circle a few miles overhead. They claim that sunset is simply the sun “moving farther away” until it disappears. Any rational person can see that this is not the case, if the Sun or Moon were moving farther away, they’d get smaller, and they don’t. In fact, they appear as large at the horizon as at the zenith. Flat-Earthers will say this is also due to atmospheric “distortion” or some such nonsense, even though such distortion is somehow never apparent or measureable in any other sense. Of course, they have no rational hypothesis for just what kind of magic holds their flat-world cosmos together, either.

Then of course, there is the matter of space travel, and the numerous photos, films, video, and of course personally witnessed views of a round, rotating Earth from space. Here’s where it gets tricky. Flat-Earthers will claim several things, one being that what we’re seeing is in fact a flat “round” Earth from above (though they can’t explain why it appears to rotate, or why the continents can’t all be seen at once), or they’ll take the position that ALL images of the Earth from space are faked, and that indeed all space programs and space travel is faked as well, and that all scientific information pertaining to the concept of a round Earth, orbiting the Sun, is all part of some huge plot or conspiracy to somehow control or dominate humanity, usually orchestrated by…Satan. Well, claims like that are hard to address directly, Satan being an unprovable supernatural entity, but the idea of a conspiracy that spans every scientific, government, and educational institution on the globe, and has gone on for centuries, seems a LITTLE far fetched, one might think. Some will claim that giant hologram projectors run by this mysterious conspiracy are actually creating the cosmos we actually see (what people saw before the hologram projectors were built is something they can’t answer). Naturally, when it comes to conspiracy theories, most Flat-Earthers are on board with many, if not most of the ones current in the popular culture. This is very typical conspiracy-theorist behavior, and it’s very rare that they are invested in one conspiracy without being invested in many others, usually with an elaborate narrative to tie them all together. The idea they nurture and cultivate among themselves, namely that they are privy to secret knowledge of a great and ominous nature that the rest of humanity is too blind, stupid, or indifferent to grasp is a very important factor in understanding the mindset that allows people to make preposterous assertions such as the Earth being flat, and do it with complete confidence. The fact that modern flat Earth theory is usually grounded (and evolved from) Biblical literalism and Christian fundamentalist beliefs that simply deny not only basic science and the evidence of one’s own eyes also tends to make it a very ingrained belief system in those who are partial to it, once they’ve convinced themselves of it’s theological correctness. Flat-earthers are never science people. In fact, I’ve never heard of or seen any science credentials offered or claimed from any person claiming this belief…but then, how could they have such? They’d fail a 7th grade science class with their level of “knowledge”. I suspect that many of these people have little formal education at all, no higher education, and that many of them are “home-schooled” (i.e., religiously brainwashed and indoctrinated from an early age).

The crucial thing that will be noted about people who believe in these conspiracies and “fringe” (to say the least) ideas like a flat Earth, is that they will almost never debate their ideas seriously. When confronted with uncomfortable facts, like orbiting satellites and space stations that are clearly visible, laser ranging that places the distance to the moon much larger and farther than they imagine and shows it orbiting the Earth at over a kilometer a second, or simple logical fallacies like the fact that it’s impossible to create a map of a “flat” Earth that has distances and travel times that remotely correspond to reality. The simple fact that a person can book a few flight and actually fly around the world themselves doesn’t seem to phase them at all. They apparently accept the idea that all the pilots in the world fly in circles and never realize it. I’ve noticed that when you start laying out some simple facts in an attempt to get these people to recognize their mistake, the response is generally that I’m a “shill”, “agent”, etc., quickly followed by silence or some attempt to ban or block me. With these people who are so totally and completely deluded, living in a complete state of denial, debate is generally a futile activity. As the saying goes, you’ve been warned. Let the insanity commence.

Prove the Earth is round –

How to measure the distance from the Earth to the sun –

How to prove the distance to the moon –

12 thoughts on “Flat Earth Conspiracy

  1. List of arguments that Flat Earth theory cannot explain which I myself thought of while mulling on the manifest idiocy of denying the spherical shape of our planet:

    1 Ships ‘hull down on the horizon’ and related observations [can be clearly seen using binoculars from the beaches of Perth Western Australia]
    2 The fact that advertised commercial air flight times agree with round Earth not Flat Earth
    3 Availability of commercial airline flight from Sydney and Melbourne to South America [they go via Auckland, NZ to Santiago de Chile ]
    4 Illumination of underside of clouds at sunset [and the changes of colour hitting ground as sun sets]
    5 Satellites visible only at dusk in Perth – mostly after the sun has set where they can be seen to enter the Earth’s shadow if traveling from west to east [FE people simply deny they exist LOL]
    6 Satellites moving from straight north to south or south to north path [FE people simply deny they exist LOL]
    7 Plate tectonics: ocean spreading and Earth magnetic field reversals demonstrated by ‘striped’ arrangement of regions of reversed polarisation. FE simply has no need and no explanation for this, I think most of them are completely ignorant concerning this feature of our planet
    8 Plate tectonics: the dimensions and locations of spreading centres as observed agrees with spherical Earth concept but does not agree at all with FE
    9 Some of us have traveled from North Hemisphere winter to Southern Hemisphere summer and vice-versa
    10 Coriolis effect – FE people simply deny it because FE theory has no explanation but round Earth concept [and fact] explains if consistently and accurately and, furthermore, Bureau of Meteorology weather predictions and charts are generated from computer modelling based on a round Earth where Coriolis effect is a fundamental feature and their maps of wind directions and weather front movements are now fairly accurate to several days ahead.
    11 Rotation of long wire free pendulum swing path and gyroscope axis through 360 degrees in 24 hours
    12 The stars of the southern sky rotate around the South Celestial Pole. I can see this from my back yard! FE theory denies the very existence of the South Celestial Pole. Why is this point #12 instead of #2? Because I kind of got on a roll and forgot this but I have now spent several hours writing explanations for people to read and need to give it a break. [NB there is one FE who lives in Tasmania. Duh, how does he explain the South Celestial Pole? Oh that’s right, he doesn’t have to because his King James Version of the Bible doesn’t mention it. [? Yeah, go on, figure that out; he just calls me names 🙂 ]]

    • The simple idea that people would fall off the edge of the earth if they went too far in the case that the earth was flat is too hard to understand apparently.

  2. I don’t know where they get this ridiculous idea about that flat earth idea. So I’m saying to myself let me test what they are saying and I did so I spinned around and to me the whole world is round. They just don’t make no sense to me it’s like they are trying to take away reality, but that’s what crackpots do.

  3. It’s hard to believe there’s people out there who are seriously trying to reinvent the flat earth nonsense, cuz that’s just what it is, nonsense, complete conjecture. There favorite word is perspective, it’s perspective this an perspective that, why cuz they got no real proof, fake models showing the sun a moon going round the azimuthal equidistant map, which they don’t seem to understand how that particular map works, just another sign of stupidity on there part. With the sun 3000 miles over head lol,well you’d see light 24 hours a day from to upper part of the sun if that were the case an if it were a disc like some of them claim,well sun rise an sun set would look a lot different to us then it does, ” perspective “. They’ll claim nasa is all fake, no satellites etc.yet they turn around an use Google map,well wouldn’t that be going against the rules. The math they use is wrong when they talk of curvature, so they end up with these ridiculous amounts of drop off that just aren’t realistic, math applied completely wrong,gives completely wrong answers, which is what they tell people. They have no explanation for midnight sun in antarctic, oh rob sekba found documents from nasa, claiming they have a patient on a fake sun now, well that explains 24 hours of Southern sun now… wait I forgot nasa is 100%bullshit so that’s out, what about before nasa there was midnight sun in antarctic, wow there so retarded. Cant explain the retro grade movement of Mars, won’t even go near that one, I wonder why.maybe cuz ya kinda need the earth to be round an orbiting the sun to explain it. Hey I lived on the coast 48 years of my life an I’ve seen 100’s of ships come an go, oddly enough they don’t just get smaller an smaller till ya can’t see them, they disappear over, (I guess the edge lol) from the hull to mast, isn’t that odd, even with visual aid. Funny you can look through a telescope from where I lived an yet ya don’t see england or France??,why not, hey maybe cuz the earth is in fact a sphere. Why are some lighthouses built over a hundred feet high? Couldn’t ya save money an time if ya built a box with a light on the ground, after all you’d see it for miles on the “flat earth” right? Look I could go on an on with the proofs of reality, biblical, physical an mathematical but these people want to believe the flat earth, it’s important to them , with I Q’s below 70 an bank accounts empty, ya kinda need something ta prop up your spirits lol. Jerarism,eric debuy an that mark bullshiting ” the heat comes from below the earth ” Sargent and others are making money off this lie,wow come on people get with it stop watching the fake u tube vids, if nasa can fake shit, don’t ya think these retards can as well, lot of vids debunking this shit, nobody seems ta watch those vids though, wow, wow, RETARDS all of ya. Get a life, get on the ball, pun intended hahahaha.

  4. Few videos to start with:

    So, you’re saying “The spherical shape of the Earth has been well-known for over two thousand years.” Yes, it’s well-known, but so is the flat earth model. They are both just scientific models. And the thing is not only about the shape of the world we live on, no. Flat Earth brings more meaning to life, just as Intelligent Design (which for me is much cooler concept, than evolution [think about it; humans are trying to achieve something which brought them to existance in the first place!]).

    Also, how can’t you feel the Earths rotation? Oh right, relativity. But what if I told you that Einstein was asked/forced to create this theory, because otherwise the globe-theory wouldn’t work? Just humor me and study “Nikola Tesla vs. Albert Einstein”.

    • Flat Earth is not a “scientific model”. It’s a conceptual absurdity that is disproven by all observational evidence. The universe is a lot bigger than your crippled 5 senses. You don’t “feel” the motion of the Earth any more than you “feel” the motion of flying in a jet plane at 500 miles an hour. The only thing you feel is inertia as velocity and direction changes, which does not happen regarding the Earth’s rotation.
      What Nikola Tesla thought or what you think he thought is irrelevant. Einstein’s work has held up to experiment extremely well. Most of Tesla’s ideas are long since proven wrong.

    • Given that it is spherical to a very high degree, it is not inaccurate to refer to it that way. Would you call a baseball a “spinning ellipsoid”? The Earth is a thousand times more precisely spherical than a baseball.

  5. I jotted down a couple of questions to ask Flatheads, but to date I have not gotten any replies. Mostly just ad hominems, appeals to Fundamentalism, or they scatter like cockroaches. I may note that I worked at an Air Force research lab on a radar that could track things in orbit; of course that makes me a “shill”.

    1. Is Australia really long and skinny like the Flat Earth map shows?

    Answer: no, that’s a projection of the globe earth onto a flat map. It gets more and more distorted in the lower latitudes, until it gets “divided by zero” at the South Pole, which becomes a ring. Which it isn’t. this is what it really looks like: http://www.mapsofworld.com/australia/ The actual distances can be verified by any means you like. This DISPROVES Flat Earth. Darwin to Melbourne, 1960 miles; Perth-Brisbane 2240 miles.

    2. Why are things up in the sky still lit after sunset? Aren’t they subject to “perspective” or whatever stops the sunlight from reaching me on the ocean’s surface? Mountains, clouds, planes, satellites … I have been in a plane past local sunset, and was in the sun while the earth below was dark. Why?

    Answer: because the sun is blocked by the horizon at ground level, but not higher up until the sun goes further around. In fact, you can prove the earth is round by this effect, and determine its circumference: http://www.astro.princeton.edu/~dns/teachersguide/MeasECAct.html

    3. How come when I took a cruise down south, the northern constellations disappeared below the horizon and the Southern Cross came up? It wasn’t “too far away”, it was BELOW the horizon.

    Answer: this is what you see when you’re on a ball.

    4. How does satellite TV work? Are there helicopters which stay up there? Who refuels them?? If they’re balloons, why doesn’t the wind move them off course? If the signals are reflected off the “firmament”, then where’s the transmitters? Are some of them in the mid-Atlantic?
    Answer: they’re called “satellite TV” for a good reason.

    5. How did I receive GPS signals in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean and the rain forest of Madagascar, but not under my metal roof?
    Answer: they’re from satellites, not “towers”.

    6. Where do meteors come from? Why are they so fast? How can they make such a big shock wave?
    Answer: way out there in outer space, and going like a bat outta hell. Which they can’t do if they just fall from the Firmament, can’t get up enough speed.

    7. Ecclesiates 1:5: “The sun rises and the sun sets, and hurries back to where it rises.” Doesn’t the Word of God thus prove the earth is a globe?
    Answer: no, the Bible is not a science book. 
    8. What is the percentage of scientists and engineers who believe the earth is flat?
    Answer: none that I know. i never got “clued in to the secret”. Because there isn’t any.

    9. Why are the parabolic network downlink antennas at your local TV station pointed at the equatorial geostationary orbit ring? And at the cable TV office? And many hotels? And some businesses?
    Answer: that’s where the satellites are.

    10. Why are Air Route Surveillance Radars only 200 miles apart, when they could be much further away if earth was flat?
    Answer: (Oooh, ooh, I know, ask me!! I’m a radar engineer!) It’s called horizon blocking, caused by the earth curvature. If the earth was flat, the radars would interfere with one another, especially secondary (beacon, or IFF) radar, which all operates on the same frequency.

    11. How come the ISS is always where NASA says it is going to be? (http://www.n2yo.com) If it’s a plane, don’t they ever run out of fuel, and why don’t the lights blink? Real planes have strobes. And how can it go over a Flat Earth in that weird S shaped curve, without burning fuel or changing course?
    Answer: it’s orbiting a globe in a vacuum and doesn’t need fuel unless it’s to change orbit a little bit. It goes around in a circle and the Earth revolves under it.

    12. When a polar orbiting satellite like Radarsat goes over the South Pole, does it go 180 degrees across the Flat Earth instantaneously somehow?
    Answer: no, it just continues over the Pole and around the globe. 

    13. When I pointed a radar at the moon, it took almost 4 seconds for the return to come back. Why is that?
    Answer: it’s because it is a quarter million miles away. It’s also solid, which is why I got a radar return. Ham radio operators have done the same thing.

    14. What’s above the Firmament? Water, or beer? How far does it go?

    Answer: there is an ionosphere up there which bounces radio waves below about 50 MHz. Frequencies above that (FM radio, TV) go right through. It’s made of upper atmosphere gas ionized by the sun’s radiation, and it changes greatly after the sun shines on the opposite side of the globe (AKA night, but I had to get that dig in). Of course this is nothing like a “Firmament”, which has to be, well, Firm. Although the original in Hebrew was the word for “sky”, but was mistranslated by the KJV people in 1512 because it sounded cooler.

    15. What’s below the earth? How far does that go? Forever?

    16. What is the dome of the firmament made of? How thick is it to resist billions of tons of pressure?, yet let meteors through?

    Answer: It’s made of Unobtanium. It sits on a foundation of diamond, which is the only material that can withstand the pressure. And it’s full of holes that lets meteors through, but not all the water. Or, maybe there’s an atmsosphere, held in by gravity, and empty space above it, which is all explained by conventional physics.

    17. What makes the sun hot? Why aren’t there any convection currents above it?
    Answer: it’s a fusion reaction in a vacuum. 

    18. Why are flatheads lying about being able to see the North Star (Polaris) south of the equator?

    Answer: that’s the only way they can get their constellations to work: lie. If somebody actually goes there (I did), they see that you can’t see it. That disproves (again) Flat Earth.

    19. Why is it dark at night? It’s many orders of magnitude lower than daytime, even though you should be able to see a glimmer of the sun.
    Answer: “Perspective” can’t just shut off light. perspective comes to a point at infinity, not a fixed distance. A solid horizon can. 

    20. How come I can stand on the seashore and see the sun disappear below the horizon? If I zoom in with a camera after sunset, it’s still gone. Where does it go? Why is the sea in the way? Why can’t you bring it back with a telescope like Flat Earth Vanishing Point theory claims? 

    21. When Admiral Byrd referred to the land beyond the South Pole the size of the USA, wasn’t he referring to East Antarctica, which is that size? Why did he refer to it as a Pole, not a ring?

    22. I drove from the mid-Everglades (where my phone wouldn’t work) to Orlando, and listened to one SiriusXM channel the whole way. How was this possible?
    Answer: it came from a satellite, not terrestrial radio stations.

    23. Why does the moon look big when it rises, and stay the same size all night? Isn’t it supposed to start really small? http://amandabauer.blogspot.com/2013/04/red-moon-rising.html
    Is this (multiple exposure) photo an actual representation of how the moon comes over the horizon, or does it actually shrink to a dot the way Flat Earth theory asserts?

    Answer: what you see is a globe circling around us. So it stays the same size.

    24. When the moon is half full, you can see shadows of craters at the dark/light line if you look through a good telescope. How can this be if the moon self-illuminates? And how does it self-illuminate, anyhow? And change phases? And create tides on earth? Doesn’t that mean it is a solid object, not a spot of light?

    Answer: Yeah, here’s how that works. Note 2 things: this is exactly the way it looks from earth, and the earth is a globe. http://www.moonconnection.com/moon_phases.phtml

    25. What satanic magic makes a foucalt pendulum work? There are lots of them, and they can’t all be hoaxes. Is it aliens? Ether? Or the turning of the earth??

    26. Cell towers are short and only go a few miles. TV broadcast towers are 500 feet and go 100 miles. Why is that?

    Answer: both are blocked by earth curvature. TV channels can be reused 200-300 miles away; there’s no interference because of blockage by the earth curvature. There’s a little troposcatter and refraction, but if the Earth was Flat you’d get TV from hundreds of miles away.

    27. Where is the flaw in this guy’s measurement? http://www.convergencestride.com/2016/02/al-biruni-measurement-earth-radius/

    Answer: he’s not wrong, and came up with a close measurement of earth’s radius.

    28. Is this where Flat Earth videos come from? http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-38168281

    29. Commercial GPS antennas aim broadly upwards, and have deep nulls toward the horizon. Why is that?
    Answer: they need to receive signals from satellites, but reject as much interference from the environment as possible. So the nulls ensure they receive very little at the horizon, where all the cell towers are.

    30. During the “super moon” of fall 2016, where the moon looked about 10% bigger, how did “they” do that? Wasn’t the moon supposed to be EXACTLY the same apparent size as the sun, according to one theory?
    Answer: it is adequately explained by classical celestial mechanics. The moon’s orbit changes a little bit now and then. Around a globe earth.

    31. One of the “proofs” of Flat Earth is that when you go high up in a balloon or plane, the horizon is level all around. Wouldn’t you see the edge of the “Firmament” closer on one side if you weren’t in the center of the “disk”, at the North Pole? Since a level horizon all around is exactly what you’d expect on a globe, doesn’t this disprove Flat Earth?

    32. If the moon is Flat, why doesn’t it look like an oval when you look at it from the side? Wouldn’t it look round only when it was perfectly overhead?

    Answer: the full moon always looks round because a sphere looks the same at any angle.

    33. So there’s auroras at the magnetic poles, which attract charged particles from the sun. The south magnetic pole is offset from the geographic pole near Australia and not even on the Antarctic mainland. So, how come an aurora can be seen from South Africa or Chile? Isn’t that halfway around the South Pole, err, ring, or whatever you call it? Doesn’t that seem to indicate the geographic Pole is one spot, not a ring? Which happens on a Globe??

    Answer: The magnetic pole is near the geographic pole, and particles from the sun end up there just like the North Pole, and make an aurora. Because the earth is a globe.

    34. How could GPS receivers figure out height if they’re getting signals from terrestrial “towers”?

    Answer: they can’t; that would be impossible to calculate altitude from a 2D flat plane. GPS satellites transmit from up in space, and receivers calculate position in 3D.

    35. What happens when you point an antenna to the sky? http://www.dishpointer.com/
    Answer: your dish gets TV from a satellite. (If you pay for it.) If you point it anywhere at the horizon, you get nothing.

    36. Is this video obviously a CGI fake made by a “Nasa shill” or actually the sun going down over the horizon? https://youtu.be/G9axKv7k07A (Note: this is not to imply that the sun is revolving around the earth, although it does show relative movement.)

    37. When you go up a hill or an elevator, the air pressure change makes your ears pop. If you go up a tall mountain, it gets hard to breathe because of the thin air. If you extrapolate that decrease in air pressure up another 100 miles, how much air do you think is up there?

    Answer: virtually none, and that’s where space starts. You can’t fly planes up there, and water would boil instantly, so rain doesn’t fall from “the Firmament”.

    38. Why does the Catholic church run an observatory? http://www.vaticanobservatory.va/

    Answer: same reason Fr. Georges Lemaître formulated the Big Bang theory, because they work hand in hand with science to further our knowledge about our universe. Which we discovered about 2500 years ago, the earth is a sphere, found out 600 years ago we go around the sun, and not too long ago that we are in a galaxy and there’s a lot of other galaxies. Although some people haven’t figured these things out yet.

    39. How can you see Pike’s Peak from 400 miles away in a plane?

    Answer: https://dizzib.github.io/earth/curve-calc/ shows that you’re at 40,000 feet, and the weather is perfect.

    40. Did you know that while Flatheads were busy pumping out YouTube videos, mostly repeating the same lies and bullshit, NASA was doing this: https://www.ecnmag.com/news/2016/12/nasa-reveals-unknown-2016 ?

    41. Does the fact that you can see Venus at night PROVE that the earth is flat?

    Answer: Well, aren’t you glad you asked. Let’s go to a “Flathead” website. http://alsetalokin.tumblr.com/post/154569523996
    Now draw a line from Venus to the top surface of Earth (tangential to the surface). It’s in the dark, right? So if you stand there, you can see Venus just after dusk. Venus is clearly above the horizon. So he debunks himself. The sun goes below the horizon (it’s night), and both Venus and Mercury are above the horizon.

    42. How come all the other planets are round? Saturn has rings around it. Why would ours be any different?

    43. “There’s NO curve…..” How do you explain this? http://stupidconspiracies.org/misc/toronto.gif

  6. And here’s a bit of theology I like to hit the Fundies with.

    Flat Earth is satanic. Science has proven that the earth is a globe, and that has been known since ancient times. Literalist Fundamentalism is an apostasy, and a result of the Protestant heresy. When you uninformed, unthinking people insist that the Bible contains literal cosmology, you cast doubt on the whole book and hold it up for derision from the sane world, who know the Earth is a globe. You feed Atheism.

  7. My final thoughts on dealing with Flatheads: don’t try to talk sense into them. Some of them are clinically psychotic. Some are just two sigmas down the bell curve on the left side, and if you could talk logic with them, they would have already used it when they saw the sun come up this morning, and thought … hmm, sun … comes up ……. but it never “dawns” on them.

    Some are sincere in their belief in the literal misinterpretation of the Bible. Those are the saddest ones, because when they finally wake up to the fact that their cosmology is fatally flawed, it can damage their faith. Meanwhile, they hold Christianity in general up for derision.

    “Do not attempt to teach a pig to sing. It will ultimately be unsuccessful, and you only annoy the pig”.

    “You cannot convince a man he is not Napoleon”.

    “You know how dumb the average person is? Well, half the people are even dumber than that.” –George Carlin

    “Flat Earth is spreading all over the globe! “

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